EVE Search - Reduce Thoraxes bay to 100m3

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Muad 'dib	Posted - 2005.08.23 12:19:00 - [1] Edited by: Muad ''dib on 23/08/2005 12:20:08 Agreed, nerf thorax drone bay by half please none of the "leave the t'rax alone, boost the rest" is bollox. The rax with named bits + drones does more DPS than an average fit BS which is why so many pirates use it - cheap and deadly, it would throw off all cruiser ballancing boosting the other races cruisers. Its no coinsidence that all the other cruisers of all teirs are ballanced and then theres the thorax. . . . its IS overpowered and has been for a very long time. Oh and boost the vigilants drones bay to 100, its silly only fitting 5 lights for a gallante/mimattar hybrid faction ship, the rupture can fit 6 mediums for gods sake.
Muad 'dib	Posted - 2005.08.25 15:36:00 - [2] Edited by: Muad ''dib on 25/08/2005 17:51:48 Wow big thread just for a little thorax. Well while reading through this i remeber seeing some1 quote that 8 heavy drones does around 170 dps. Well just for the record my rupture with 4x gyro IIs and 4x 720mm IIs does 200 dps. So any argument against the raxes drone bay nerf is null and void - Rax is overpowered and its the drone bay that does it. pro Rupture pilot with 8 mil in gunnery using ranged weapons 200 dps noob Thorax pilot with 800k in drones using just heavy drones 170 dps edit: apparently thats with a few level 5s, so maybee more than 800k sp... still faaar less and not counting turrets. Its like the old raven when it comes to SP vs. output
Muad 'dib Caldari Smoking Hillbillys The Volition Cult	Posted - 2005.08.25 15:36:00 - [3] Edited by: Muad ''dib on 25/08/2005 17:51:48 Wow big thread just for a little thorax. Well while reading through this i remeber seeing some1 quote that 8 heavy drones does around 170 dps. Well just for the record my rupture with 4x gyro IIs and 4x 720mm IIs does 200 dps. So any argument against the raxes drone bay nerf is null and void - Rax is overpowered and its the drone bay that does it. pro Rupture pilot with 8 mil in gunnery using ranged weapons 200 dps noob Thorax pilot with 800k in drones using just heavy drones 170 dps edit: apparently thats with a few level 5s, so maybee more than 800k sp... still faaar less and not counting turrets. Its like the old raven when it comes to SP vs. output
Muad 'dib	Posted - 2005.08.26 08:49:00 - [4] Originally by: Nomen Nescio Edited by: Nomen Nescio on 25/08/2005 23:11:05 Originally by: Garreck Wrong.The heart of my argument actually just took place when somebody mentioned that they can get 200dps with their rupture. My point is that the rupture (and any other cruiser) can begin doing that damage immediately. Man you can't be that s.... Rupture fits for damage and get 200 dps "instant" damage, and that' it. Thorax with NOTHING fitted has 170dps. And 5 guns on top of that. How could you not understand it?!! Thorax fittted the way rupture is will do 200 dps at the ranges of rupture with no problem. PLUS the drones. PLUS THE DRONES is the problem, not a thorax as a ship. What else can you say to make it clear? This is EXACTLY what i ment to add to this disscussion, i wasnt trying to compare the Rax to the Rupture in a 1v1. Whiners will not whine more if the rax is nerfed, its unballenced atm and with 1600mm plates being so easy to fit and the raxes mwd bonus; that just adds more 'fuel to the fire'. Anyone know what a rax puts out in DPS from a medium blaster setup, im thinkin about 300, with the 150 odd from drones thats a 450 dps monster - even if it is close range its almost DOUBLE the power of other cruisers, although max dmg isnt really the issue its the almost effortless 'free' dmg. Sure there cant be may 'dont nerf the rax' people left, appart form those who own a researched BPO and have gallante cruiser 5 lol.
Muad 'dib Caldari Smoking Hillbillys The Volition Cult	Posted - 2005.08.26 08:49:00 - [5] Originally by: Nomen Nescio Edited by: Nomen Nescio on 25/08/2005 23:11:05 Originally by: Garreck Wrong.The heart of my argument actually just took place when somebody mentioned that they can get 200dps with their rupture. My point is that the rupture (and any other cruiser) can begin doing that damage immediately. Man you can't be that s.... Rupture fits for damage and get 200 dps "instant" damage, and that' it. Thorax with NOTHING fitted has 170dps. And 5 guns on top of that. How could you not understand it?!! Thorax fittted the way rupture is will do 200 dps at the ranges of rupture with no problem. PLUS the drones. PLUS THE DRONES is the problem, not a thorax as a ship. What else can you say to make it clear? This is EXACTLY what i ment to add to this disscussion, i wasnt trying to compare the Rax to the Rupture in a 1v1. Whiners will not whine more if the rax is nerfed, its unballenced atm and with 1600mm plates being so easy to fit and the raxes mwd bonus; that just adds more 'fuel to the fire'. Anyone know what a rax puts out in DPS from a medium blaster setup, im thinkin about 300, with the 150 odd from drones thats a 450 dps monster - even if it is close range its almost DOUBLE the power of other cruisers, although max dmg isnt really the issue its the almost effortless 'free' dmg. Sure there cant be may 'dont nerf the rax' people left, appart form those who own a researched BPO and have gallante cruiser 5 lol.
Muad 'dib	Posted - 2005.08.26 13:45:00 - [6] Originally by: Naughty Boy thorax = 1.79 (4 damage mod) * 5 (number of guns) * 22 (ammo damage) * 1.25 (hybrid skill) * 2.4 (damage mod) * 1.25 (cruiser skill) * 1.10 (specialization skill) * 1.15 (surgical strike) / (4.875 (base rof) * 0.75 (rapid firing) * 0.9 (gunnery skill)) = 283 dps. rupture = 1.79 (4 damage mod) * 4 (number of guns) * 22 (ammo damage) * 1.25 (projectile skill) * 6.9 (damage mod) * 1.25 (cruiser skill) * 1.10 (specialization skill) * 1.15 (surgical strike) / (15.75 (base rof) * 0.75 (cruiser skill to 5) * 0.75 (rapid firing) * 0.9 (gunnery skill)) = 269 dps. It doesnt matter much what range the guns are as long as your comparing the same for all ships. Id like to see gank maller and gank moa results but with max drone dmg added to it aswell, that is where the problem lies i didnt compare guns before as everyone knows that blasters should do the most dmg of all close range weapons. The reason i used long range is because there better ballanced, and we see that the ships are in the same rough area, but when drone dmg is added the thorax will jump out in front, and if it was using blasters too that would create an even bigger gap (no doubt overtaking most BCs in max dmg).
Muad 'dib Caldari Smoking Hillbillys The Volition Cult	Posted - 2005.08.26 13:45:00 - [7] Originally by: Naughty Boy thorax = 1.79 (4 damage mod) * 5 (number of guns) * 22 (ammo damage) * 1.25 (hybrid skill) * 2.4 (damage mod) * 1.25 (cruiser skill) * 1.10 (specialization skill) * 1.15 (surgical strike) / (4.875 (base rof) * 0.75 (rapid firing) * 0.9 (gunnery skill)) = 283 dps. rupture = 1.79 (4 damage mod) * 4 (number of guns) * 22 (ammo damage) * 1.25 (projectile skill) * 6.9 (damage mod) * 1.25 (cruiser skill) * 1.10 (specialization skill) * 1.15 (surgical strike) / (15.75 (base rof) * 0.75 (cruiser skill to 5) * 0.75 (rapid firing) * 0.9 (gunnery skill)) = 269 dps. It doesnt matter much what range the guns are as long as your comparing the same for all ships. Id like to see gank maller and gank moa results but with max drone dmg added to it aswell, that is where the problem lies i didnt compare guns before as everyone knows that blasters should do the most dmg of all close range weapons. The reason i used long range is because there better ballanced, and we see that the ships are in the same rough area, but when drone dmg is added the thorax will jump out in front, and if it was using blasters too that would create an even bigger gap (no doubt overtaking most BCs in max dmg).
Muad 'dib	Posted - 2005.08.26 14:19:00 - [8] Originally by: Naughty Boy People suggesting to remove oversized plates but keeping the drone bay are fighting against their own goal, this will definetly kill the thorax as a close range ship and make their drones worthless. Sounds logical to me. agreed 110%. Cruisers needed the plates, but the thorax does not need 8 heavy drones, 10 mediums perhaps just not so many of those damned heavys.
Muad 'dib Caldari Smoking Hillbillys The Volition Cult	Posted - 2005.08.26 14:19:00 - [9] Originally by: Naughty Boy People suggesting to remove oversized plates but keeping the drone bay are fighting against their own goal, this will definetly kill the thorax as a close range ship and make their drones worthless. Sounds logical to me. agreed 110%. Cruisers needed the plates, but the thorax does not need 8 heavy drones, 10 mediums perhaps just not so many of those damned heavys.

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